gothwalk | (no subject)

I've been watching some impressive forms of LJ drama go down over the last two days. I've more or less stayed out of it on LJ. More fundamentally than anything else, it's about two people who have strong personalities (or not having met them, it could be strong virtual personalities - but I doubt it) who are mutually opposed, and the rest of it is just people lining up along the magnetic personality lines of force.

However, I'd like to take this post in a different direction, and wonder why these dramas seem more extreme, stormier, on LJ than on, say, a mailing list or an irc channel.

There are multiple factors involved, and I'm going to mention several of them before getting metaphysical with one of them. First up, LJ has no controlling element, no list-owner or admin. Each individual can control, to some degree, who or what s/he sees, and so there's no need for an admin to be constantly on-duty. This is also true of some other virtual environments, such as LambdaMOO, but they're more immersive and less populated.

Second, that previously mentioned control is somewhat illusory - unless you think very carefully about what you're doing, you will end up seeing things you might not want to see, or showing other people things you don't want them to see.

Third, and this is the one that looks trivial, and isn't: LJ uses the word "friend" to signify someone you want to read, and someone you will normally allow to read your more private posts. That "and" there can't be emphasised enough - because if you think about it for a minute, these two categories are not always the same.

I've dealt with this by simply never posting friends-only posts - every single one of my posts is out in the open, and anyone can respond to them, anonymous or not.

Further: Words are magic. It's a tenet of most forms of paganism that will is magic, and words are just a focus, but this seems not to be the case. Words make huge differences. And the word that the LJ admins have chosen to use here is "friend" (possibly derived from the friend toggle on talker lists - or some common root). If they'd chosen to use the words "permit" and "follow" for the two functions of the friends list, people would feel very different about it. If they'd used just "list", or "track", things would be different again.

I'm not suggesting that this be changed, as such. But it makes a difference, and for those of you who do a lot of livejournalling, it's good to see that difference.

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I'm not so sure. Most of the conflict I've seen is between people I know already - which is basically people from TH. I haven't seen them have this sort of conflict there - I mean, there are plenty of arguments on TH, but it's generally been about issues (gun control springs to mind) rather than about interpersonal things, who-said-what, etc etc.
I think that on LJ, people assume they can and should talk about *everything*, because it's their journal - whereas on mailing lists, people go there to talk about a specific range of subjects (even on TH), and there's an understanding that some things, especially interpersonal conflicts, are offtopic and should be dealt with off list.
In addition, maybe LJ encourages people to play to the audience more? Because they have this named group of 'friends' who they can get reactions from?
Certainly, it's still down to the people involved to choose how they use LJ. But I think for some personality types, especially the more extrovert and perhaps the more manipulative as well, it makes conflict more likely and more public.
Oh, and the other thing - people seem to have a lot of real-life friends on LJ, more so than on mailing lists I've seen. So interpersonal things from non-net life spill over, plus there's more chance to say "why do you say X happened? It wasn't X, it was Y"...
And, it may all be just the way I'm seeing it...

*nods* I keep my LJ because I like to talk about things like my gender issues in a forum where I can get feedback and not feel *quite* so much like I'm just going around in circles in my head. It's sort of one step above a regular paper journal (which I keep, I just don't write it in as often) -- it's a journal that's open to the public, which means that it's really not a diary as such. I tend not to post too many personal specifics as far as my interactions with other people, especially people who I know read my LJ or are likely to come across it. For example, while I make mention of Dave in my journal and sometimes talk about how I feel about him, I have a personal policy never to post about something important about our relationship without talking to him about it first. I don't want to be put in a position where I say something negative (or even just different) and he ends up feeling that I can talk to fifty-odd friends and acquaintances (and anyone else who stumbles across it) but I can't talk to him. Instead, I limit my posts to news about my life and stuff from my personal headspace that I feel comfortable sharing. It's actually been a very big deal for me to talk about my gender stuff in an open forum, because it's sort of my first attempt at "coming out" with some of this stuff. But in that case, it fills a purpose, and I'm willing and even eager to have commentary and share stories with others.

While I see you there, and while you mention it, although I've probably never commented on the gender posts, I am interested. I have friends who are in all of the various categories that are all lumped together as "queer" (except actual post-op transexuals - at least, I don't know of nay post-ops - so if I know you and you're reading this, count it as very successful. :) ) so I like to read the various points of view and ideas.

I think that quite a bit of the interpersonal on TH plays out behind the scenes - email flies as people "talk behind one anothers backs," as it were.

I only lock to "friends-only" one kind of post, the ones about housemate trauma, because Cein & I made that agreement. He reads my journal, I read his, but we aren't on each other's "friends" list so that we can vent about the house w/o the other one getting the brunt of it. Of course, now that he's not talking to me it would be nice to be able to hack into his journal so I know what he's thinking/planning, but I'm not doing that.